Has botting destroyed the entire game?

[An4rchy]

 

15 hours ago, aLzhite said:

 

mkay, if that makes u accept the fact that reborn is a bad server here u go.

 

entire movement & heading system. target's location aint correct. target's heading never being correct so to make sure blow skills land and get the most effective damage from back, you must bluff/blinding blow to the target to make sure heading being forced to the correct place even tho the target u trying to attack clearly showing its back. facestabs possible most of the time, most of the skills failing to the target whos showing their back if u dont bluff.    u said "identical" and supposed me that i cant understand the diff between j and off. thats not how movement system works on l2off

 

The visual bugs you're refering to (target showing their back when really their heading is different) are not caused by the server. Each input you make into the client is sent to the server to calculate the correct heading, position etc. However, there's always going to be desync and some minor character movements that are caused by other effects/collision might alter the player's heading client-side, but such info is not sent to the server causing wrong calculations. And this exists in L2OFF too.

 

15 hours ago, aLzhite said:

 

 

entire debuff system. im not giving detailed information about this but thats not how debuff landings work on l2off

 

entire skill formulas & hit times. just focus on ppls pvp videos to see if anyone using vortex skills for an example. while surrender giving you %70 dmg boost; vortex giving like %10 -this examples values are not correct, i just wanted to make an explanation for 60iqs- so they dont even bother using it. maybe thats on server developer's doing, maybe thats how they wanted it to be but almost all the acis based packs are the same. thats not how stuff work on l2off

 

 

It's true that old packs used to have incorrect formulas but you need to understand that it's not really easy to replicate a math formula based only on result and testing. And I would say nowadays l2j is pretty close to the retail formulas for % landing or damage. But if you think 'if it's not 100% same, it's crap' then it's a different story. Also most servers keep adding a shittone of customs that affect mdef/pdef and resists which ends in a fiesta. Btw L2 was never balanced, if balance is what you're refering to. And it was never meant to be played full buffed at all times, so unless you're talking about no-buffer lowrate off servers, they're still crap.

 

15 hours ago, aLzhite said:

fps. i dont even bother checking for stuff on a server to understand if its java or off. i know what my avg fps is so if its waaaay below then the pack is acis or lucera. for a plus on lucera; it has the same fps issue but during mass pvps, you also getting nonsense lag when u get closer to the action's center and it goes normal if u ran away from the pvp. its not about the machine even if u install the server to the ramdisk, this problem still exist on lucera. btw idk if they fixed it, its forever ago i played on a lucera based pack.

 

https://prnt.sc/nioe7m acis & lucera

 

https://prnt.sc/nioedk crap frozen which stopped being developing over a decade

 

and they flamed me with "10k valakas spawned behind a wall" to decrease my fps instead asking politely what was the problem :))

 

The only reason I can think of server interfering with FPS is networking. It's true that L2J packs handle some packets wrongly and the result is them being spammed to the client (for example, sending 3 UserInfo when 1 is needed for some actions). When a packet is sent to the client, then it has to make the proper changes for the effects to be visible. If you send more than the necessary packets, the client will do more work each frame, leading to FPS issues. But to be honest, I don't think older L2 clients ever did a good job at performing during mass PvPs, even in L2OFF servers that I've played.

 

15 hours ago, aLzhite said:

i dont have any education about coding. what made me get into coding is you guys being so ignorant, not talking to you directly. i was quite happy being a player.

 

"clean and well developed project like Reborn."

what fact u need to accept is -yes, accept. its not my humble opinion or something anymore- reborn is a bad server or u also start posting about l2damage is a good server. it has a good popularity also. having players wont make damage a good server but ppl keep playing there isnt it? and stop talking about people who you have no idea about their knowledge.

 

Population does not mean a server is good, but persistent population sure does. But 'good' is subjective after all I guess. I don't think L2Damage is a good server or that we can even talk about L2Damage since it's a PvP server. I don't even care for PvP servers as the game was never meant to be played like that.

 

I think you give very little credit to what L2J teams and developers are trying to do or have done so far. Replicating the logic of an MMO game is a big deal and even if we've not reached 100% similarity (or ever will), I think it's generally more worth giving all your efforts in assisting this task rather than undermining the whole concept just because it's not 100% similar to L2OFF from the beginning (how could it be?).

[aLzhite]

On 6/26/2022 at 12:22 PM, An4rchy said:

Population does not mean a server is good, but persistent population sure does. But 'good' is subjective after all I guess.

 

i got what i wanted. i dont have to fix/answer all above. just about l2j, im not against l2j. i wanted to help. idk why u defending l2j to me here, i thought we talking about reborn. the thing about l2j devs is, they are not active players so most of them dont know how stuff works ingame. so they coding/fixing them like "hmm i think thats how it should be" and thats the problem. like how many of you know when ur attack is launched and the target died halfway thru and ur damage wont shown but if its crt, Critical Hit! message still appears?

https://prnt.sc/FsXrUv2EpAaT yes, that might look like a minor bug of l2off but if the goal is making the l2j look like l2off; then thats required imo. even those little details are needed to be implemented. its easy but why would no one did it until now? cuz they have no idea this exist on l2off. they busy flaming everyone shows the flaws on their work xd even you. having no idea about the bugs exist on l2reborn but still defending me that server for pages. imma start thinking you are the dev of that server  cuz there is no sane explanation for those messages

[Ugleethyn]

1 hour ago, aLzhite said:

 

i got what i wanted. i dont have to fix/answer all above. just about l2j, im not against l2j. i wanted to help. idk why u defending l2j to me here, i thought we talking about reborn. the thing about l2j devs is, they are not active players so most of them dont know how stuff works ingame. so they coding/fixing them like "hmm i think thats how it should be" and thats the problem. like how many of you know when ur attack is launched and the target died halfway thru and ur damage wont shown but if its crt, Critical Hit! message still appears?

https://prnt.sc/FsXrUv2EpAaT yes, that might look like a minor bug of l2off but if the goal is making the l2j look like l2off; then thats required imo. even those little details are needed to be implemented. its easy but why would no one did it until now? cuz they have no idea this exist on l2off. they busy flaming everyone shows the flaws on their work xd even you. having no idea about the bugs exist on l2reborn but still defending me that server for pages. imma start thinking you are the dev of that server  cuz there is no sane explanation for those messages

What the HECK the client has to do with the back end languages? Client does what the back end language says him to say! You can say that the developers are idiots or I don't know but STOP refer to something as "l2J" the J at the end has NOTHING TO SAY ABOUT THE SERVER! replace 'l2j' with 'L2 Made by stupid developers' or  I don't know....

[An4rchy]

6 hours ago, aLzhite said:

 

i got what i wanted. i dont have to fix/answer all above. just about l2j, im not against l2j. i wanted to help. idk why u defending l2j to me here, i thought we talking about reborn. the thing about l2j devs is, they are not active players so most of them dont know how stuff works ingame. so they coding/fixing them like "hmm i think thats how it should be" and thats the problem. like how many of you know when ur attack is launched and the target died halfway thru and ur damage wont shown but if its crt, Critical Hit! message still appears?

https://prnt.sc/FsXrUv2EpAaT yes, that might look like a minor bug of l2off but if the goal is making the l2j look like l2off; then thats required imo. even those little details are needed to be implemented. its easy but why would no one did it until now? cuz they have no idea this exist on l2off. they busy flaming everyone shows the flaws on their work xd even you. having no idea about the bugs exist on l2reborn but still defending me that server for pages. imma start thinking you are the dev of that server  cuz there is no sane explanation for those messages

 

The point of emulating the gameplay of a client you like is to be able to modify it and change what doesn't appeal to you. That's why l2j exists in the first place. The bug you mentioned is just what we call it, a 'bug'. L2j fixing this bug is not a bad thing so I don't understand your point about the Critical Hit message (unless you were trying to prove you know all the details about l2off which I already believe you for).

 

I'm not the developer or have anything to do with L2Reborn other than playing in x30. I didn't start defending l2j from you, you pointed out that you don't like java servers and you prefer l2off, that's why this conversation started. And I still believe Reborn is a good server, at least in most players' eyes.

[Boystahp]

This botting rant is 20years late. 

 

Now here comes a real question, can anyone answer it?

 

Why did NC West allowed botting on retail? I started on retail in 2004 and played til 2012. 

During C3 I was 100% legit, after that i started botting and never stoped. All my friends botted, all enemies botted, and I dont remember people getting banned, even with mass reportings.

 

The only real time when NCwest did something was when my CL got reported for ruining a roled played marriage in game. He got banned for THAT. But not for botting.

 

Can anyone please tell me what was NCWests strategy allowing this to happen?

 

Thanks

 

 

PS: you guys talking about Reborn and etc. The best server around is Elmore Lab by mister @MasterToma Dude does a better job than a full department of NCs coders. 

Edited July 11, 2022 by Boystahp

[Sail0rMo0n]

Yes and no. After so many years grinding has become tedious and some players keep playing only because they can bot. This is especially true because of server closures, re-openings and wipes. Others still enjoy the gameplay and others have stopped playing because of botting. Of course, another part of the community which bots is involved in rmt and does not play as much for enjoyment.

 

In my experience, GMs in private servers who care eventually ban botters and keep gameplay at healthy levels. The problem is that L2 is an old game and that the newer versions that NCSoft created did not become popular. Also, private servers did not do a good job at maintaining themselves. Don't worry though, Lineage III is coming soon! Trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSTahTUVYao

TLDR: Some have left because of botting while others have stayed because of botting. People who enjoy playing the game can keep enjoying it.

 

[GsL]

11 hours ago, Sail0rMo0n said:

Yes and no. After so many years grinding has become tedious and some players keep playing only because they can bot. This is especially true because of server closures, re-openings and wipes. Others still enjoy the gameplay and others have stopped playing because of botting. Of course, another part of the community which bots is involved in rmt and does not play as much for enjoyment.

 

In my experience, GMs in private servers who care eventually ban botters and keep gameplay at healthy levels. The problem is that L2 is an old game and that the newer versions that NCSoft created did not become popular. Also, private servers did not do a good job at maintaining themselves. Don't worry though, Lineage III is coming soon! Trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSTahTUVYao

TLDR: Some have left because of botting while others have stayed because of botting. People who enjoy playing the game can keep enjoying it.

 

 

 

Do you blv that crap is lineage 3 ? 

And that will be the of l2 ? 

 

Huh huh

[Dimension5]

On 6/27/2022 at 11:43 PM, An4rchy said:

I'm not the developer or have anything to do with L2Reborn other than playing in x30. I didn't start defending l2j from you, you pointed out that you don't like java servers and you prefer l2off, that's why this conversation started. And I still believe Reborn is a good server, at least in most players' eyes.

I would at least expect you had played on the x1 from the very start to have such a strong opinion on the matter..

 

the server is (or at least was, i havent played in quite some time) legit crap, i have played over 100 servers since 2004 (including official c4-interlude days) and reborn had by far the worst files

[An4rchy]

Just now, Dimension5 said:

I would at least expect you had played on the x1 from the very start to have such a strong opinion on the matter..

 

the server is (or at least was, i havent played in quite some time) legit crap, i have played over 100 servers since 2004 (including official c4-interlude days) and reborn had by far the worst files

 

Reborn started on aCis and then migrated to lucera. Their files were not the best, sure, but they've been improved by a lot over last couple years. They have a stable community of over 2000 online players and they keep updating regularly. No, I didn't play on x1 because I don't have the time, but claiming the server is shit while being the most successful online server at the moment is stupid.

[darta]

On 6/20/2022 at 3:59 PM, Seamless said:

Official- Every mmo has some kind of bot issue,  but nc soft instead of improving the game to become better more modern and secure from exploits they said fuck it lets introduce auto farm system and make the acquisition of items almost impossible even with 24/7 auto farm. In addition they dont even care about the desktop version since most income is from lineage 2 mobile. Its a company not some kind of no profit orgnization to feed your nostalgia. 

 

Private servers - You have around 100 options to choose each week. New servers are introduced every day and everyone is try to build a community which is impossible since we talk about 50.000(?) of total player base. 10% of those  have real online players and  90% using fake bot systems to show that their server has some kind of activity. Also the 90% of those private servers using the same packs with 0 effort to introduce something new and unique.  It's a dead end. 

 

 

Move on - its 2022 fast pased games have conquered the gaming industry and no one has the time to spend 12 hours in front of a computer to achieve 1% progress. Just choose an l2  server that suits your interests  play a few days, feed your nostalgia repeat. or find a new game.

Lineage2ertheia did their own unique stuff till this day and still almost no one plays anymore.

 

Most people like auto farm and no brain

[An4rchy]

5 minutes ago, darta said:

Lineage2ertheia did their own unique stuff till this day and still almost no one plays anymore.

 

Most people like auto farm and no brain

This server is a PvP server. The era of PvP servers is long gone, with 1-2 PvP servers only still successful worldwide (and even them are 70% bots, 10% shops and 20% players, but they still make money).

 

The only reason people played PvP servers until 2015-2016 is because retail/mid-rate was too hard and time-consuming for casual players and they wanted to experience endgame more easily. These players don't play anymore, or got older and found more time to re-join low/mid rates.

[Mobius]

Do not spead whatever "righteous" crap streamers say.
Streamers actually get payed by gaming companies to cover their failures and push their agendas.

You say bots killed Lineage 2.
I say botting gave activity to a dead game.
The game's actual fame was raised because of bots.
I guess noone here played on Bartz or Devianne on C4.
Noone remembers Baium been blocked by bot clans? Characters been boosted by catacomb bots?
Famous private servers flooded with bots, even when botting was bannable?

If you had a server and add fake players, fake shops, fake site online count, p2w "donates",
with the delusion that on 2022 your payed "protection" laughably protects your server,
without any system threading, database or networking optimization,

your escape goat for failure is bots and the shitty project you used?

NC did nothing private servers did not do first.
At least they did it better and got a huge chunk of their player base rightfully back.

 

Who would play on retail servers if they did not do the changes they did?

Do you even play Lineage 2?

 

Do you even play other MMO games?
Lets move on to WoW botting and how banning all bots destroyed a massive player community.

Remember the continuous mass account bans on retail WoW Legion?
Subscribers droppped from 13 million to 1.5 million.
You can say that bots destroy economy...
Like WoW tokens, Black Auction house, character boosts and other donates did not...
Bots where players, that botted, but also raided, pvped and flooded the servers with life.

Blizzard and NC wealth was built uppon bot accounts and their monthly subscriptions.

The games they develop now whould never exist without them.

Everyone saying otherwise is a gaming customer, not a gamer.

 

Edited September 8, 2022 by Mobius

[BabayG]

https://youtu.be/eJo_d9HyIDA

[Dimension5]

13 hours ago, An4rchy said:

 

Reborn started on aCis and then migrated to lucera. Their files were not the best, sure, but they've been improved by a lot over last couple years. They have a stable community of over 2000 online players and they keep updating regularly. No, I didn't play on x1 because I don't have the time, but claiming the server is shit while being the most successful online server at the moment is stupid.

please do tell me more about how good the server was without playing it at all

 

 

ps: this was over 2 years after the launch and it wasnt the most gamebreaking bug at all  

Edited September 8, 2022 by Dimension5

[An4rchy]

11 hours ago, Dimension5 said:

please do tell me more about how good the server was without playing it at all

 

 

ps: this was over 2 years after the launch and it wasnt the most gamebreaking bug at all  

 

So what? You expect everything to be perfect? Please do tell me more about the bugs on a game being nonexistent without knowing jack shit about game development.

 

Everything is improved and fixed with time, in any game. Countless triple A games had game breaking bugs, it's completely normal. The code, maths and technologies used behind a game are so complex you would lose focus the first 5 seconds if you tried to study it. (Speaking from experience, that's basically what I got my degree on and work on.)

 

Reborn would have been a shit server if they ignored such bugs. They don't, they keep improving. That's what makes the server great with a big and stable community. But L2 players are cancerous, they only point out the flaws and never the positive parts, even though Reborn has been a home for them for over 2 years.

 

-

 

Something irrelevant, why do people hide their skillbars in such pictures/videos? What is the point? To hide your super new mechanics you discovered on a 20 year old game?

Edited September 9, 2022 by An4rchy