Discussion What if?

[Solomun]

Simply. It would not work.

[Tryskell]

14 hours ago, SillverShadow said:

What if ALL ( the legit ) Server and Client developers from maxcheaters worked on the SAME PROJECT?

What do you think would happen?

 

How good do you think the result would be?( technically ofc, coz the idea would be of the company/person they worked for )

 

How many would go to jail coz they killed someone from the team coz they don't like them? ^_^ 

( with not everyone being friends with everyone else it would be hard but lets say you had someone pay you 5000euro/month to work on a project alongside the rest of the devs )

 

sometimes i see someones work and i can't help but think
"imagine what we could do if we all worked together" 

we( as a community ) have amazing modelists , GXF ppl, codespitting developers, interface experts, network pros and they almost never work together...
that leads to a server with poor code and amazing interface or amazing code but the server looks like shit, or stupid code and interface and amazing websites and so on...

 

 

It can't be, because people got different expectations about what is good for a server. Also, the leader question is a very big question.

 

I must add L2J never commited a single thing comming from all their forks (they don't want), and when you share something they would take months (if not years) to commit a single line edit. All the forkers never released their work when they stopped to play with L2J, so basically all the forks is like lost work.

 

It's basically impossible to improve the mother project, because heads don't want to. The main problem is L2J leaders to begin with.

 

Believe me or not, I'm the sort of guy who like to reunite things. I personally asked to take back L2J IL fork a long time ago, the answer was "no" (that would mean aCis would be ported back entirely into L2J IL, and then it would be open source and all commits would be available to anyone freely, and reusable by L2J too). I also asked to L2JFrozen if they wanted to merge (there was a topic on their forums), they said "no".

 

And you forget the fact there is multiples chronicles, which makes impossible the "one project" possibility.

 

People simply DON'T WANT to make a single project, forkers destroy their work on purpose once they stop to care about L2J, and L2J is really hard to move on due to specific choices.

 

Due to their choices, L2J is now 3 developers and there was no commits since 4 months, despite it is a fully open source, fully downloadable, and fully forkable.

[SillverShadow]

interesting.

since you mention ( and focus ) on the source part and the chronicles , here is my view on the issue.

Lineage 2 is old( very old ) and there are games out there that have much better graphics and  more useful functions ( jump, more with wsad, cast while moving etc ) 

I mention that to point out that every single server that opens is the exact same game ncsoft made all those years ago, with all the same mistakes ( game design mistakes ) and useless functions, they just change the name to Lineage XXXXXX, recolor items, rename items and THAT'S IT.
We( anyone who make a "no customs" server or even a "custom" one are recycling the same million times chewed gum and "selling" it as a new one, on and on.

Lineage needs to change in it's core ( i have been making an attempt for quite a while now, and the results will be available to everyone at some point in the future ) but more people need to innovate and by innovate i mean take a source ( no matter what, l2jserver acis frozen whatever ) and with it CREATE LINEAGE FROM SCRATCH WITHOUT ALL THE STUPID CRAP NCSOFT PUT IN THERE.
For example, i have seen many try to get the exact formulas ncsoft uses right and my question is "why??"
i have never seen a game have such bad formulas for calculating stats and results(damage, critical accuracy  etc )

the player when looking at his stats window has no clue what the numbers he sees mean, a simple example is critical chance and accuracy, 500 critical rate, why not give him the % since we are talking about RATE. or 20 accuracy and the enemy has 20 evasion , the player doesn't know his hitland rate he just sees random numbers tries to make the number bigger and hopes for the best.

WHY NOT remake all those formulas into something that would allow players know how good or bad their character is in each field.
( someone may say "it's coz the stats you have late-gameare prefixed by the game since we know what items you will be using late-game and everyone uses the same items, has the same skills etc, so the difference is minimal )
that i would argue is an other mistake that needs to be fixed.
Think outside the box and with the knowledge you have ( and you have a lot of it ) make a BETTER lineage, don't follow the stupid path ncsoft left you on )
oh and about the chronicles, just pick the one with most clientside content and you are good to go. 

sorry for the long post...got carried away, but i think it's good food for thought :)
Cheers !

Edited August 12, 2018 by SillverShadow

[Tryskell]

You waste your time then, simply pick latest Unreal Engine and make your own game "inspired of" Lineage 2.

 

Lineage 2 is Lineage 2 for a reason, if you want to make another game call it with another name, and find people to code it with you. But that's basically a game company.

 

The point of a Lineage 2 emulator, is to emulate Lineage 2. Final point. If your point is to make Angry Bird, PUBG, or whatever else game, simply pick a real engine to begin with, and not reused UE1.5 with graphical assets of 2004 of a old MMO.

Edited August 12, 2018 by Tryskell

[SillverShadow]

i see your point.
that ( making a game from scratch) would be ideal 
it would also require recreating the client and the server side while what i suggested was fixing the existing one ( saves you a lot of time :) )
you are right about the emulation part but i think with all the interface edits and the automations we( as a community ) have added to the game we have moved past the simple emulation and are trying to make the game as relevant and advanced as we can.

[Kara]

Someone tell that guy that when you work alone you achieve better results.

Example the fan made P.T which made by 1 guy and was better than the original. 

[Quark]

21 hours ago, SillverShadow said:

"imagine what we could do if we all worked together" 

we( as a community ) have amazing modelists , GXF ppl, codespitting developers, interface experts, network pros and they almost never work together...
that leads to a server with poor code and amazing interface or amazing code but the server looks like shit, or stupid code and interface and amazing websites and so on...

 

 

WTF?

Show me ONE who can create amazig NPC from scratch - meshes, animations, sophisiticated textures - eg. Anakim

Show me ONE with skill compared to guy(s) from NCS who modeled and animated female dwarf or female kamael.

What about sounds music? Show me  ONE with talent compared (ok, can be 10%) to Billy Brown.

 

With almost free licensed UE4 we got nice tools, we can make easy legally client part, but where skilled modelers?

 

And last part, mentioned alredy by Tryskell - working within team.

Originally l2j is dead due bad management. Ok, bad managers.

 

I hate to say it:

FORGET

 

But I like your post and idea - I'm a daydreamer too.

 

 

Edited August 12, 2018 by Quark

[Finn]

Mankind is a bunch of morons. That's why skynet is going to win eventually. Ths fkn Kara already infiltrated MxC. :D

 

 

5 hours ago, Tryskell said:

....

 

Lineage 2 is Lineage 2 for a reason, if you want to make another game call it with another name, and find people to code it with you. But that's basically a game company.

 

.....

 

 

Ok, our new game will be called "Bloodline 2". We do not need a first Game. We start with the second game ^^

Edited August 12, 2018 by Finn

[Kara]

18 minutes ago, Finn said:

Mankind is a bunch of morons. That's why skynet is going to win eventually. Ths fkn Kara already infiltrated MxC. :D

Ok, our new game will be called "Bloodline 2". We do not need a first Game. We start with the second game ^^

 

Yes afcourse mandkind is bunch of morons when it apart from people like you. This "fkn" kara you mention back in 2012 helped more people than brain cells you have, yet the only thing you did on maxcheaters is to "[Request Help]". So the infiltratation by useless people is done by you i guess. At least i offered something back then in this forum other than just post meanless posts sometimes. Crawl back to your cave now and dont bother answer back.

 

Also.. skynet yes.. maybe arnold too?

Edited August 12, 2018 by Kara`

[SillverShadow]

how unfortunate it is to see you guys call humanity stupid and a bunch of moron and have no problem including yourselves in that bunch, accepting the title that defines some( mby most ) but not all....

some of you embrace the selfishness of humans and politicians,

thank the "non-existent creator of all" not everyone is so eager to grab the title of "i am human and i have flaws so i cant do the right thing even when i know it's right coz i am supposed to be selfish" and i have found open-minded people to work with :) thank you for letting me know how you see things.
 

reminded me of this 

Dont be the first pair, be more like the second! <3

 

Edited August 12, 2018 by SillverShadow

[Kara]

1 hour ago, SillverShadow said:

how unfortunate it is to see you guys call humanity stupid and a bunch of moron and have no problem including yourselves in that bunch, accepting the title that defines some( mby most ) but not all....

some of you embrace the selfishness of humans and politicians,

thank the "non-existent creator of all" not everyone is so eager to grab the title of "i am human and i have flaws so i cant do the right thing even when i know it's right coz i am supposed to be selfish" and i have found open-minded people to work with :) thank you for letting me know how you see things.
 

reminded me of this 

Dont be the first pair, be more like the second! <3

 

 

Small and fluffly? Ok!!

[Tryskell]

3 hours ago, SillverShadow said:

i see your point.
that ( making a game from scratch) would be ideal 
it would also require recreating the client and the server side while what i suggested was fixing the existing one ( saves you a lot of time :) )
you are right about the emulation part but i think with all the interface edits and the automations we( as a community ) have added to the game we have moved past the simple emulation and are trying to make the game as relevant and advanced as we can.

 

Your relevant version of Lineage 2 isn't the relevant version of someone else. For exemple, if I had the choice I would simply stop Lineage 2 to C3 (even the map), raises the engine to UE3, add more polygons to actual models, improve maps (add more locations instead of all those empty plains), add some wildlife/lore addition and orientate the gameplay around faction system Dawn vs Dusk (which exists but is underused). I wouldn't introduce Olympiads, Primeval Island and numerous other things.

 

I would inspire from some features taken from other MMOs too. I would probably add some, like a blood pact with summons as a summoner, and other things like that.

 

My vision is probably not your vision, at all.

 

Regarding the community, it is bound both in gameplay changes and ideas because of the client. We're limitated to make things than the client is able to make. If our imagination got no borders, the L2 client got. Packets got their own limitations.

 

I'm not sure what is your relevant and advanced version is, but if it matches with all the popular servers, I probably won't play your game.

Edited August 12, 2018 by Tryskell

[SillverShadow]

posting my opinion about what you just said would lead to an endless argument( i've seen some on this forum )
i want to evolve the game and add to it, you prefer the older version of it and are copying ncsoft as well as you can.
we both established our wants, let's agree to disagree ( it is personal opinions after all )

thanks for taking the time to answer my question :)

[xxdem]

19 minutes ago, SillverShadow said:

posting my opinion about what you just said would lead to an endless argument( i've seen some on this forum )
i want to evolve the game and add to it, you prefer the older version of it and are copying ncsoft as well as you can.
we both established our wants, let's agree to disagree ( it is personal opinions after all )

thanks for taking the time to answer my question :)

 

So who would be the leader of your so called "pro-best-of-all" project members before they fight each other for the leadership of the utopian project your talking about? Who makes the decisions? You are probably underage and you can't understand politics

[SillverShadow]

by carefully reading the first post i wrote you will see that this is a hypothetical situation in which there is someone who gives all these people money to complete tasks, i didn't say work together or on the same part of the code, i said work on the same project, you make the x system and someone else makes the y system and they are compatible with each other.
I never said i admire their leading skills or their personality even, i said that their skills if focused on the same project would produce a great result ( in my opinion ).

Also i never said their ideas should be combined into a single project, this is a misunderstanding.

They would WORK ( create what the person that gives them the money tells them to create ) you know as freelancers do.

 

Not important but i will respond to the underage part too :)
i am not underage and i do understand politics and much more about social behavior than i care to explain. Understanding how something is and accepting it as it is without trying to change it if you see flaws are different things and i cant accept some things when i can change them.
As i said before i have found people that dont think how others act and think is what they should/need/must do or think.
And i am sure i will find many more in the future.

 

I want to make sure no one sees any of the things i write as an attack or an insult, i am expressing my personal opinion and that can be right or wrong in the eyes of different people, just communicating my thoughts and ideas.

Cheers!